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UK - S5D plus 18-40 for £699

I don't need another S5, but having the 18-40 for when I want to be travelling very lightweight would be nice. I guess I could sell my current S5 for £500 so the 18-40 wouldn't cost a lot and I'd have a new S5.
 
pdk42 said:
I don't need another S5, but having the 18-40 for when I want to be travelling very lightweight would be nice. I guess I could sell my current S5 for £500 so the 18-40 wouldn't cost a lot and I'd have a new S5.
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If I were you, I would do exactly this. This proce is too good to be true.

In the risk is, that there is a new Lumix model (no high end) we do not know yet. I mean, why is Panasonic selling the S5 so low? They need a fullframe product below 1k. I do not think that the S5ii will drop below that barrier. At least not within the next 2 years.
 
I have mixed feelings about this price being so low. For sure it’s good to have low prices, but it kills used values! On top of that, it seems that the main differentiator Panasonic have in FF is price. I know we love our S cameras, but let’s face it, aside from price they are just not competitive:

- S1 range - well past its sell-by date. No current hi res camera available (the S1R is all but dead).

- S5 - CDAF only, which is perceived as very weak compared to other brands.

- S5ii - the best camera in the current line up, but seen by many influencers as lacking in AF capabilities compared to rivals. Plus, that 24Mp sensor, as gorgeous as its output is, is now seen as a bit old school (slow read out rates, “only” 24Mp).

- S9 - very niche and dismissed by many as just a lightweight “creators” vlogging camera; lacking too many essential features to make it truly general purpose camera.

And in a more general sense, if you go looking at DPR and similar fora, Panasonic gets a kicking for its lack of new releases and “innovation” in recent years.

I really hope that Panasonic hit it out of the park with the S1ii, and do it soon, since this spiral to the bottom on pricing can’t auger well for them long term.
 
pdk42 said:
I have mixed feelings about this price being so low. For sure it’s good to have low prices, but it kills used values! On top of that, it seems that the main differentiator Panasonic have in FF is price. I know we love our S cameras, but let’s face it, aside from price they are just not competitive:

- S1 range - well past its sell-by date. No current hi res camera available (the S1R is all but dead).

- S5 - CDAF only, which is perceived as very weak compared to other brands.

- S5ii - the best camera in the current line up, but seen by many influencers as lacking in AF capabilities compared to rivals. Plus, that 24Mp sensor, as gorgeous as its output is, is now seen as a bit old school (slow read out rates, “only” 24Mp).

- S9 - very niche and dismissed by many as just a lightweight “creators” vlogging camera; lacking too many essential features to make it truly general purpose camera.

And in a more general sense, if you go looking at DPR and similar fora, Panasonic gets a kicking for its lack of new releases and “innovation” in recent years.

I really hope that Panasonic hit it out of the park with the S1ii, and do it soon, since this spiral to the bottom on pricing can’t auger well for them long term.
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I've just been watching the latest LUMIX Live webcast and Sean answers a question that kind of addresses some of the points you are making. It's around the 58:20 mark in the video if you're interested. Essentially, he says that Panasonic does not do what the big brands do, i.e. more frequent incremental camera body releases. They operate differently.

Speaking of AF, check the comments in the DPR article about the recent Fujifilm firmware updates that are meant to improve AF in a number of models. Users are tearing Fujifilm a new one (so to speak), despite the reviews from DPR and PetaPixel that claim is really good.
 
Very interesting "state of the art" regarding Panasonic's FF, Paul:

pdk42 said:
- S1 range - well past its sell-by date. No current hi res camera available (the S1R is all but dead).
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Agree 100%.
pdk42 said:
- S5 - CDAF only, which is perceived as very weak compared to other brands.
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Agree.
pdk42 said:
- S5ii - the best camera in the current line up, but seen by many influencers as lacking in AF capabilities compared to rivals.
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Not for video.
pdk42 said:
Plus, that 24Mp sensor, as gorgeous as its output is, is now seen as a bit old school (slow read out rates, “only” 24Mp).
Click to expand...
We always forget about the 96mpx high res shot, and we have it handheld, that not many other FF cameras from other brand offers.
pdk42 said:
- S9 - very niche and dismissed by many as just a lightweight “creators” vlogging camera; lacking too many essential features to make it truly general purpose camera.
Click to expand...
Agree.
pdk42 said:
And in a more general sense, if you go looking at DPR and similar fora, Panasonic gets a kicking for its lack of new releases and “innovation” in recent years.
Click to expand...
At this point I want to mention that the Lumix gh7 has been chosen as one of the best video cameras of 2024. I think it offers 32 bit floating audio recording, Pro Res Raw and the ARRI log; that makes the camera innovative and competitive enough in terms of video / cinematic content creation, and I guess all that stuff will come with the next S1Hii:

www.cined.com

Panasonic LUMIX GH7 Review – A Closer Look at One of Our Cameras of the Year | CineD

Panasonic LUMIX GH7 Review – A closer look at one of our Cameras of the Year 2024, including sample footage.
www.cined.com www.cined.com

According to cined.com, the Gh7 is very good in terms of dynamic range, rolling-shutter, and latitude:

"“Panasonic did it again – the LUMIX GH7 is in a class of its own considering the Micro Four Thirds sensor size! Not only does it show good rolling shutter values, also the dynamic range results don’t disappoint. They are quite similar to the recently tested Sony A9 III or the Canon EOS R5 C, for example. As mentioned, it plays in the league of recent consumer full-frame cameras with those results (a bit o the lower end, through) ".

I just hope that they do something similar with the next FF video centric camera :)
 
Insane pricing, totally insane possibly to the extent of devaluing the brand (even further).

This is close to giving it away in terms of the individual lens cost.

It's the inverse of the crazy price gouging in food, insurance and other life necessities. Paul mentioned affordable or cheap food prices in Japan, same in all Asia... Whilst the take away fish and chips UK working class staple is now a hideously expensive endeavour and I don't buy the supposed reasoning for it. I have theories but it's a camera forum so I'll not bother.
 
The 699£ is about 850€. The price for the S5D Kit in Germany is actually 999€ at several big stores around the country (from 1599€ USP). The reduction is a mix of 300 rebate and 300 „christmas“ rebate.
In my opinion the USP of 1599 is way to high, with this price Panasonic will sell nothing! But with 999 this is a very good price for beginners, as second body etc… The price in UK is even better!
But the 999 is the official internet price now. If you go direct to your local dealer something more is possible from my experience. Because of that I bought nearly everything over the last 4 years from one dealer. We know each other and I get always good prices from him!

About the prices for used equipment: Actually the market for used „older“ S equipment is quite down, a friend got for his S5 only 450€ when he upgraded to the S5ii in autumn. I got only 350€ for my Sigma 1.4/50 when I upgraded to the 1.2 Sigma…
I just saw a used S1 in good condition for only 700€…
If you not go mainstream (CaNiSo) used equipment will not get proper prices, it is always (much) lower. But also the equipment from the major three struggles because of big reductions in the last time…
 
RBecker said:
The 699£ is about 850€. The price for the S5D Kit in Germany is actually 999€ at several big stores around the country (from 1599€ USP). The reduction is a mix of 300 rebate and 300 „christmas“ rebate.
In my opinion the USP of 1599 is way to high, with this price Panasonic will sell nothing! But with 999 this is a very good price for beginners, as second body etc… The price in UK is even better!
But the 999 is the official internet price now. If you go direct to your local dealer something more is possible from my experience. Because of that I bought nearly everything over the last 4 years from one dealer. We know each other and I get always good prices from him!

About the prices for used equipment: Actually the market for used „older“ S equipment is quite down, a friend got for his S5 only 450€ when he upgraded to the S5ii in autumn. I got only 350€ for my Sigma 1.4/50 when I upgraded to the 1.2 Sigma…
I just saw a used S1 in good condition for only 700€…
If you not go mainstream (CaNiSo) used equipment will not get proper prices, it is always (much) lower. But also the equipment from the major three struggles because of big reductions in the last time…
Click to expand...
I almost bought an S1 in good condition from an eBay seller for £515. But in the end, I figured I have the S1R and if I really need better low light I have the S5. I’d rather spend on lenses than more bodies.
 
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